Help me choose a caliber for white tails

[ChrisHarris]

Three barrels, and only one T/C Hawken stock.  I've been told by the land owner that my shots could be 300yds, so that basically means no shot.  I DO want to see how my gun shoots at higher yardages.  I've got it sighted in at 100yds.  I'm not foolish enough to try a 300yd shot.  But I'm confident enough to try a 150yd shot.  Just need to work up a load and figure out the drop at different distances.

These are my options:
Factory T/C .45 barrel with 1:48 twist
Sharron .45 barrel with 1:66 twist
Green Mountain(GM) .54 with 1:70 twist

All are legal to use in the state I am hunting.  I live in Colorado but I'm hunting in Nebraska.
The Sharron .45 and the GM .54 are both extremely accurate. The factory T/C .45 barrel with its compromised twist isn't as accurate, but it shoots conicals a darn sight better than either of the slow twist barrels.  That's not surprising to any of us. 

The Sharron is pretty much out IMO, because the 128gr PRB just doesn't pack as much punch when it gets out around 100yds.  Energy is down under 300lbs at that range.  I don't feel comfortable with that.  I want to make a good shot and a quick kill.  But if somebody wants to convince me otherwise, I will certainly listen to experience.

The GM .54 shoots PRB very well with a load I worked up.  70gr Goex 2F with .018 pillow ticking and a .530 Hornaday swedged lead ball at around 224grs.  I have it set to zero at 100yds.  Energy at that range is very good.  I feel like its enough to put a hard hit on any white tail, so long as I do my job and place the shot well.   It's shooting about 1.5"-2" high at 25yds.   It's around 3" high at 50yds.  Dead on at 100yds.  That's with the load I described above.

Last weekend, I loaded it up to 100grs Goex 2F and shot it 130yds.  It only dropped about 4" from the previous load (70grs and 100yds).  I am going shooting this weekend and I intend to shoot it at a 143yd target. (best we can do at the range I have access too).  The GM instruction manual says 120grs of 2F is the max load.  I can load it up and shoot it, but it makes me a little nervous.  Would you guys have a problem loading it up like that and shooting?  I guess I just want to see how it shoots at farther distances and higher powder charges. I know it's going to take a lot more velocity to carry a sphere through the air at increased distances.

Then there's the factory T/C barrel.  The conicals-maxis-minis-ballets etc.   I've found .430 and .435 conicals from 200gr to around 350gr.  Any of those is plenty of weight IMO.  More weight than the .530 PRB.  I would assume that a 245gr T/C Maxi with a max load of 90gr 2F is going to shoot flatter and carry as much or more down range energy.  Heavier bullet, probably very close to the same velocity as the .530 PRB, and accurate enough to do the job.  I haven't looked at enough BP ballistics charts and I certainly haven't shot enough to know for myself.

Which one would you choose?  I feel like I need to be comfortable at 150yds and try to get a shot at 120 or less.

[beowulf]

any of them would be a good choice , but one thing , that "compromise twist " is`nt  ,I have seen many an old rifle from the 19`th century with that twist ! actually pretty good for a.45 ! the bigger question is what are you using ? round ball or conical ?

[bugflipper]

What I've found is the 1-48 twist likes shorter conicals. If they get very heavy the intermediate twist won't stabilize them as good. Mine all like the lighter lee real bullet offered in each caliber (200 gr in 45). Even though that's a bit lighter than a 54 ball, down range it would have more energy and less drop. For longer range I like a 54 conical or a 58 minie, a ball just isn't the best thing for long range. Would recommend some fiber wads like circle fly or homemade starting with about 80 gr and working up in the 45 and 200 gr real bullets.

Range   Velocity   Impact   Drop   ToF   Energy   Drift
0   1600   -0.5   0   0   1137   0
10   1574   0.23   0.11   0.02   1100   0.46
20   1551   0.82   0.36   0.04   1068   0.53
30   1529   1.28   0.75   0.06   1038   0.66
40   1507   1.58   1.29   0.08   1009   0.83
50   1485   1.73   1.98   0.1   979   1.05
60   1464   1.71   2.84   0.12   952   1.32
70   1443   1.55   3.85   0.14   925   1.64
80   1423   1.2   5.04   0.16   899   2.02
90   1402   0.69   6.39   0.18   873   2.44
100   1383   0   7.92   0.2   849   2.91
110   1363   -0.87   9.64   0.23   825   3.44
120   1345   -1.93   11.54   0.25   803   4.02
130   1326   -3.19   13.64   0.27   781   4.65
140   1308   -4.64   15.93   0.29   760   5.34
150   1291   -6.3   18.43   0.32   740   6.08
160   1273   -8.15   21.13   0.34   720   6.87
170   1257   -10.24   24.06   0.36   702   7.71
180   1241   -12.54   27.2   0.39   684   8.61
190   1225   -15.07   30.57   0.41   666   9.56
200   1210   -17.82   34.17   0.44   650   10.56

[bugflipper]

That was an idea of what 90 gr should be close to of coarse you'd have to work up the most accurate load that particular gun will shoot. The only 1-48 twist 45 I have is a t/c cherokee and it likes 90 gr with the 200 gr real. I plink with 55 gr as it shoots good there as well.

[Hanshi]

The .45 shooting a prb is excellent up to around 100 yards and maybe a little more.  But if you expect any shots much beyond that then the .54 is the only choice.  A .530" prb over 120 grns of 2F is no problem at all.  I use to shoot 110grns of 3F in my .54 and that load would really shoot.  It gave between 1700 and 1800 fps and was accurate like you wouldn't believe.

[William]

If your potential shots really will be 100 yards and more, and you have worked up an accurate load and practiced at the longer ranges then I would choose the 54 caliber barrel.  My .54 trade rifle with it's Investarms barrel and 1:48 twist is extremely accurate at 100 yards using 85 grains of 2f, but my eyes limit the distance at which I feel confident in hitting what I'm aiming at so that is my max.  All that does is make me rely on my hunting skills to get as close to the game animal as I can, still hunt or set up in an ambush area.  The place you will be hunting dictates which one you will be able to do more so than what caliber is best.  What works for me here in South Texas probably won't work in Nebraska Land.  Due to the colder weather, deer are heavier bodied than in places with warmer temps generally speaking and if you'll be hunting in wide open spaces then I would use my .54 as well.

[hotfxr]

The range I go to has gongs out to 345 yards. I can hit the gong with my GPR using 100gr of 3F and conical bullets 4 out of 4 shots after ranging in. I have yet to hit it with any of the 45cal rifles. Of course the GPR has a 1:32 twist. When that 435gr conical hits that gong, everyone on the range knows it. I have no doubt it will take down a deer at that range. I do have many doubts about whether or not I could hit a deer at that range shooting off hand.

[ChrisHarris]

It comes down to the .54 with a 220gr PRB or the .45 with a conical of similar weight. 

I see the .45 T/C barrel (shooting conicals only) as having more down range energy and flying flatter...... IF I use a small conical as BugFlipper suggested. 

I know I can shoot a 4" group with the .54 at 100yds using a PRB.   And so far, high load testing has shown the balls drop less than I anticipated.

I think I may load the GM .54 with 120gr 2F and a PRB.  That's my first shot.  If I also load the T/C .45 with a conical and I just happen to get a 2nd shot, it's quicker to swap barrels than to reload the .54.  I can carry a loaded barrel in my pack.   

Our out-of-state tags permit us to shoot 2 does.  We're hunting the Republican unit - near Beaver City.

[William]

Unless you just really want to carry that extra weight around, I'd opt for a quick reload in the field if a follow up shot is needed.  Carry only 3-4 RB and enough powder to shoot them in your hunting bag and no more, and your back will thank you at the end of the day.  Personally I would not be satisfied with 4 inch groups at 100 yards and would continue to work up a more accurate load.  A 2 inch group from the bench would be my goal at 100 yards, and then I'd know exactly how much the ball would be in flight relative to the distance with 100 yards being my point of aim/zero line.  Even at 130 yards, I would not adjust my point of aim if I was shooting 2 inch groups.

[Dogshirt]

Just my $0.02, but if it takes you less time to change barrels than to re-load,  I'd work on re-loading. I can get off 3 shots in about 1 min10 seconds.  And if you have to pack all that around you run the risk of mixing balls and loads. . The whole idea is  one Cal. one load. And the .54 will do it all if you do your part. Don't make this harder than it needs to be.

[ChrisHarris]

Well, definitely no need for the .45 barrel with conicals.    

I went shooting today with the T/C Hawken and the .54 GM barrel.  I was shooting Hornaday .530 swedged balls using .018 ticking and 70gr Goex 2F. 

I made a few sight adjustments because I switched from my front globe sight, back to the stock blade sight, and then back to my Lyman globe sight a few months ago and have only shot it twice since then.  It was shooting a little to the right because I didn't get the front globe sight back into the same position as before.  So I used a heavy screw driver and a small hammer to drift the sight back over.  Got it dialed in for the left/right.  Shot the heck out of it at 25yds and 50yds to make sure it was hitting center target - but high.

It's about 2" high at 25yds and 3" high at 50yds with 70gr of powder.

Moved out to 100yds and shot the heck out of it.  Still only using 70gr of powder.  It's pretty much dead on at 100yds.  I never did hit the bullseye, but I was getting decent groups close to the center, so I was satisfied.  I was able to get 4" groups at that range and load.   

I loaded it up to 100gr and moved out to 140yds.  Thats as far as I can get at that particular range.  It's only 2" - 3" low and still showing good groups.  Largest spacing between any of the rounds was 4" 

Went back down to the 50yd range to see how it shoots with 100gr.  It's about 6" high. Put it in the truck and came home. 

[William]

I would go back down to 70 grains and start at 50 yards, shooting groups of three to five times, then increase by 5 grains and repeat until I found the best powder charge.  Don't adjust your sights either, just find what amount of powder gives you the tightest groups.  Once there then go to 100 yards and see where it hits.  This is when you can adjust, move or file your sights.

[Blackfeet]

  Personally I would not be satisfied with 4 inch groups at 100 yards and would continue to work up a more accurate load.  A 2 inch group from the bench would be my goal at 100 yards, and then I'd know exactly how much the ball would be in flight relative to the distance with 100 yards being my point of aim/zero line.  Even at 130 yards, I would not adjust my point of aim if I was shooting 2 inch groups.

Personally, I would be very, very happy indeed with 4" groups at 100 yards with an open sighted hunting rifle. A well centered 2" group at even 50 yards would have won most of the bench-rest matches this summer, except maybe a couple where Papa thumped us.
I do think though that if I were capable of consistent 2" groups at 100,  I might adjust my point of aim for the extra 30 yds after evaluation of the load at that range.

No offense intended

[William]

  Personally I would not be satisfied with 4 inch groups at 100 yards and would continue to work up a more accurate load.  A 2 inch group from the bench would be my goal at 100 yards, and then I'd know exactly how much the ball would be in flight relative to the distance with 100 yards being my point of aim/zero line.  Even at 130 yards, I would not adjust my point of aim if I was shooting 2 inch groups.

Personally, I would be very, very happy indeed with 4" groups at 100 yards with an open sighted hunting rifle. A well centered 2" group at even 50 yards would have won most of the bench-rest matches this summer, except maybe a couple where Papa thumped us. I do think though that if I were capable of consistent 2" groups at 100,  I might adjust my point of aim for the extra 30 yds after evaluation of the load at that range.
No offense intended

No offense taken.  My opinion is that my hunting rifle should also be my target rifle and from a bench rest, a 2 inch group at 100 yards would translate to a 4 inch group offhand group.

[hotfxr]

  Personally I would not be satisfied with 4 inch groups at 100 yards and would continue to work up a more accurate load.  A 2 inch group from the bench would be my goal at 100 yards, and then I'd know exactly how much the ball would be in flight relative to the distance with 100 yards being my point of aim/zero line.  Even at 130 yards, I would not adjust my point of aim if I was shooting 2 inch groups.

Personally, I would be very, very happy indeed with 4" groups at 100 yards with an open sighted hunting rifle. A well centered 2" group at even 50 yards would have won most of the bench-rest matches this summer, except maybe a couple where Papa thumped us. I do think though that if I were capable of consistent 2" groups at 100,  I might adjust my point of aim for the extra 30 yds after evaluation of the load at that range.
No offense intended

No offense taken.  My opinion is that my hunting rifle should also be my target rifle and from a bench rest, a 2 inch group at 100 yards would translate to a 4 inch group offhand group.

Remind me never to go shooting with you guys. With my eyesight, I would be lucky to have a 14" group at 100 yards.