When is America going to wake up.

[Hawken50]

  OK this I dont consider as political, and if anyone thinks it is i will remove this post.  Ok Canada has had an attack on their Parliament, And now some idiot has attacked some NYC police officers with a freakin axe. When are we going to stomp the crap outa these brain damaged nuts. Keep your head on a swivel friends cause the crap is coming down. I have a feeling this is going to get a lot worse.

[mongrel]

There is an old fable about a tiger being cursed with sympathy for the animals it needed to kill in order to eat, and as a result starving to death. The point being, an excess of sympathy can be as deadly as an excess of cold cruelty.

I am not suggesting that the mentally ill should be killed or even in most cases forcibly incarcerated. Very few situations in life call for an all-or-nothing approach like the simple-minded majority of people in the world seem to want; compromise and balance are always possible and usually preferable. However, one theme I see repeated in many/most of the recent shootings and attacks is someone of less than ideal mental health not receiving or accepting treatment and/or medication, while at the same time our society persists in the notion that even then they ought to be treated just like everyone else in order to avoid the accusation of unfairness or persecution. Add the relatively easy access to weapons that I firmly believe a free society should have, for a variety of personal and political reasons, and the resulting mix can, obviously, be deadly.

Even the most compassionate society has the right and duty to protect itself while at the same time protecting the inherent rights of its majority of citizens. I shouldn't have my right to ownership and use of weapons restricted because a manic-depressive who's off his meds might also access weapons and do something unthinkable. When we're faced with that possibility, the manic-depressive is the problem; I and my guns, knives, and other weaponry am adamantly NOT. I am very sensitive to the feelings of family members who don't want a loved one to feel singled-out for their mental health issues and I'm even sympathetic to my fellow citizens who probably wouldn't welcome an additional tax burden to get mental health facilities back up and running at full steam. However, I've given up being the touchy-feely tiger who can no longer get a decent meal because he feels sorry for his fellow creatures. Life is all-too-often a series of tough choices, and when it comes to the actions of one individual potentially affecting (or destroying) the well-being and lives of others, we as a society have an obligation to make those choices and take necessary steps -- with or without the consent of those who want everyone treated perfectly equally, despite the obvious fact that perfect equality is an impossible illusion.

[punjab]

Unfortunately I am old enough to have lived through both cycles of ways to deal with those less fortunate than most of us.When the courts said you can not lock up people just because their deck is short a few cards we didn't provide the funding to properly deal with them.So now they wander the streets and in some cases become very aggresive and a real problem.I happen to live in an area where the problem is very bad since the larger cities Seattle and Tacoma tell people they would be better off down here because living costs are less.Two years ago we voted a tax increase to deal with it but the money just keeps accumulating because the "experts"continue to study the problem.I agree many of these types are quite capable of living in society if they take their meds and have supervision.But apparently we would rather ignore the problem accept that "we are studying it".

[hotfxr]

In our relatively affluent county with a population of 800,000 or so living in amongst the hundreds of vineyards and fine dining, bragging on being one of the top tourist destinations in the US, the denial of societies problems run rampant. There have been almost a dozen gang related shootings in the past two weeks, three deaths by stabbings from mentally unbalanced folks, one who stabbed himself to death. And we just had the one year anniversary of the Andy Lopez shooting. For those who don't know, Andy Lopez was a 13 year old Latino kid who was walking along in a heavily Latino populated area with an airsoft BB gun replica of an AK-47 with the orange tip broken off. When a sheriff's car rolled up on him a deputy shot him 7 times in less than 10 seconds. Needless to say the last year has seen demonstrations and riots over this shooting. That deputy is back on patrol which has set into motion a new set of problems in our increasingly divided population. Throw into the fray a county supervisor that was caught at 3 in the morning in his underwear trying to break into a womans house and is still a supervisor (without a criminal record I might add) and you really have to wonder what is going on in the land of the free.I'm just glad we have people like those on this forum that actually have some insight and understanding. And I am especially pleased to read the thoughts of my friend and brother Mongrel who injects a dose of critical thinking and good old fashioned common sense into the conversation. Spending time here on this forum gives me hope that things in this world might balance out eventually.

[Rockwell Torrey]

Right there with you.

There are 2 things in the way our world works that prevent any real solution from being implemented.

1. Nothing happens in politics that does not gain votes or money.  Enforcing laws = vote loss, making new laws that do nothing or make things worse but look good in the news = more votes (patriot act, TSA, gun control).

2. The Sheeple and the uneducated masses are the majority of the voting public and want no real change unless it gets them more benefits.

I offer no solution but it does bring to mind 2 tag lines I like.

Democracy is 2 wolves and a sheep voting on what to have for dinner.  Liberty is a well armed sheep contesting the vote. (the 1st American Revolution)

A government that robs Peter to pay Paul can always depend on the support of Paul.  I guess that makes me just a giant Peter.

[Whiskeytangofoxtrot]

When I see conversations like this one start , I remember something my father told us when we were young.

" The problem with people is if you have more than 2 of them you are going to have problems"

Point is you can't treat everyone that is "unbalanced" due to the fact that most go undiagnosed, or are
Diagnosed only after the atrocity, (like our Batman theater murderer here in Colorado).

These types of attacks have gone on since Cain and Able and will go on as long as there are 2 people within proximity to one another long after we are gone.

To me this is the most compeling argument to keep and bear arms.

[Hawken50]

 I was referring more to the attack on our country by another so called group who is calling for lone wolves to attack our cities and target our servicemen. Well i guess unbalanced would apply here.

[beowulf]

I was referring more to the attack on our country by another so called group who is calling for lone wolves to attack our cities and target our servicemen. Well i guess unbalanced would apply here.

that " group" has been unbalanced since the seventh century . men like vlad tepes had a cure for them that while it did not prevent the atrocities , did slow them down ! our problem is that we try to fight fairly , there is no such thing as a "fair " fight , and those who believe there is are doomed to lose ! god knows  they have no sense of fairness , and while I personally hate the idea of using their methods , if we dont all want to be either deceased or a convert to their belief system we have to harden our hearts and give no quarter in this fight !

[Hawken50]

   I have always thought that if you found yourself in a fair fight ...... your tactics sucked.

[beowulf]

totally agree !

[mtnmike]

In my neck of the woods I Don't give a warning shot,I know of no-one who doesn't own home protection,with the amount of Illegals getting shot,I get the impression 911 isn't used much.
  We may be backwoods hicks,but we have a few things figured out.

Whiskeytangofoxtrot,,I agree 100% with what your father said,,Here in NC we have been fighting that cause since 1865, when the WBTS was over NC didn't go along with other states in ratifying things.
I had a "suit" order me for a mental evaluation, then he found out EVERYBODY here thinks along the same lines as me.  We were taught as kids.and teach our kids & grandchildren the same beliefs that have been in play for many generations now.

[punjab]

Beowulf "that group"know exactly what they are doing.They are bent on converting us or wiping us out and whether we admit it or not we are at war.Unfortunately the power structure simply wants to declare victory and ignore the whole thing.Oh well I am headed out to the range to burn some powder in my flinter,that I understand.