Black powder Revolvers

[pilgrim]

     Recently I have grown an interest in Revolvers.  had an interest 15 years ago but let it pass.  Now I am researching revolvers in the thought of a purchase.  Most every reproduction Colt type revolver has no backstap, while the  Remington type  revolver has a backstrap.  Some research material stated that Colts had no backstrap while Remingtons had a backstrap.   So much for the internet.  Yet while searching the NRA site/museum, they show a Colt original with a backstrap.  What gives?  What would be a good 1st time starter revolver to purchase?  I have compared the steel versus brass. Which is better/stronger?  With or without backstrap?  Seems that the revolver without the backstrap can be totally disassembled for cleaning. 

     I know there are many pistoleros  here and figure this is the place to get the needed info before any purchase is made. 

[Rev]

The Remington's are far stronger & more accurate. The rear sight on the Colt is a notch on the hammer which cannot be aligned exactly the same way every time it is cocked. Never seen a Colt with a backstrap...

[Hawken50]

Well the first colt that eveyones familiar with that had a topstrap was the 73 Single Action Army, But colt did make the Colt root wich had a topstrap and an externally mouted hammer.This is all prettymuch a moot point as noone reproduces it.
What you will encounter now is reproductions.The Colt will range from the huge Walker Colt from 1847 throught the the last of the percussions auhe 1862 Police,all opentops.
  The Remingington which started as the Beals model,then the model of 1863,went pretty much unchanged til their cartridge revolvers came out in 1875.It is recreated today as the 1858 new model army.
There are a few odbball copies of the civil war revolvers that were really copie of the colt and remington patterns,sych as the Griswold and gunnison.

[Hawken50]

Order Dixie gun works cataloge.There,s a lot of history in there cataloge,Best 5 bucks you'll ever spend.

[flintboomer]

Order Dixie gun works cataloge.There,s a lot of history in there cataloge,Best 5 bucks you'll ever spend.

I second that.

I have won trophies shooting with colt style revolvers against single shots, Remingtons and Rugers, so they aren't all that inaccurate as long as everything is tight, but a solid frame will last longer if it is shot a lot with heavy loads.
Everything out there has its advantages and disadvantages, so do some more research and decide what you like the looks of. If you get a chance to try something out for the feel or a chance to shoot something you are interested in don't pass it up.

[Hanshi]

Since the late 1960s I've owned a Remington '58 and a Rogers & Spencer.  They are very strong revolvers, alright.  I also found them to be astonishingly accurate; easily equal to modern revolvers.  Though I've never owned a Colt c&b I find them to be the more handsome of the two.  At the top of the heap is the Colt Army.  My quest is to get hold of a Uberti 1862 Pocket Police.

[flintboomer]

Something else to think about is that the cylinder pin on the remingtons is much smaller and will not carry as much fouling, so the cylinder has to be pulled more often for cleaning.

I own both and I like both. I like the looks of the 1860 army best, but others will have other preferences.

The other question is .31, .36, or .44 caliber? I prefer the .44 but I also have .31 and .36.
The longer 7 1/2-8 inch barrel of the standard colt and remington 44s gives a better sighting plane but for smaller or weaker hands the .36 might work better. The grips are all small by modern standards. The .31 calibers are too small and don't have enough energy, but they still shoot

[Hawken50]

  I've been shootin cap and ball revolvers since 84.Having owned a dozen or so over the years i still prefer the Colts over the Remington.The best handleing and most accurate one I personlly have had was an 1851 London Navy 36 cal.made by Uberti.Ive had Remington Pattern revolvers made by pietta and uberti and every dandged one would rap my knukles with the triggerguard.The Ruger old army is a built like a TANK,but I dont care for them.

[pilgrim]

     Thank You Rev Hawken50, flintboomer and Hanshi for you advice and input.  When I get a BP revolver, it will have the longer barrel and be a 44 cal.  That much I have decided on.  What really bothers me is that I know deep down inside, I will end up with a reproduction of both Remington and Colt.  As if I don't already have enough to shoot.  Definitely will be in the market for more 3F Goex.  I should have followed the advise on TMotC when I last purchased 25# powder.  Should have just ordered 3F instead of 25% 3F and 60% 2F and 15% 4F. 

[Hawken50]

No worry there pigrim,You can use both 3f and 2f in the 44's.The only differance will be that 3f will foul less and be a tad more powerful.Shoot i'm using 3 f in evertything from a 45 senaca to my 50 hawken.My Walker seems to thrive on it.But 2f works well also.Even my 60 army digests 2 f well.Just a little more fouling.Actually next time just order 3f,you've probly got plenty of 4f.

[beowulf]

whatever you get , make it a steel frame !  the brass frame guns shoot , and shoot well but if you use full loads all the time they tend to loosen up on you !  my personal favorite is the 51 navy , and a few years back ( 2006 ) had a chance to buy a colt root revolver in good condition fro $175  but did`nt have the cash at the time ! heck of a deal and had to pass it up !

[pilgrim]

     When comparing the 1860 Army, which is a better made revolver, a Pietta or an A Umberti?   The 1860 Army is a sharp looking pistol as well as being historically preferred.   

     Concerning powder charges.  According to the Pietta manual minimum charge is 12 gr 3F while max charge is 15 gr 3F.  Where a different article  discussing Pietta and Umberti states 30 gr as max.    For targets I have no need for a max charge, unless it gives better accuracy.    What is the true max load for either  Pietta or A Umberti.  I cant get a  manual from Umberti's web site for comparison.  But di get a sort of manual for both Pietta and Umberti. 

     If loading a max charge of 30 gr 3F,  is this considered a hunting load?  When target shooting, is the lighter load as accurate versus a heavier  charge, considering I do my part?

     Concerning the powder charge,  1 pound of 3F should last a long time.  When shooting the Lyman Plains pistol all I used was 10 gr 3F.  At that rate I could theoretically shoot 700 shots to 1 pound powder.  with 15 gr 3F=466 shots.  with 30 gr 3F=233 shots. 

[Hawken50]

Well Pilgrim,,,man i feel like John Wayne when i say that.   I have heard that Pietta is making better than in the past,but the samples i've seen did not impress me. Now Uberti has never disapointed me.Now the only 1860 i have right now is an old Armi San marcos form the 70's.It is on a par with the new uberti's.Ive always used a full 30 grain load under a .454 round ball with a lubed felt wad tween powder and ball.The revolvers ive had seem to prefer the heaver charges.I'd say go with the uberti.

[texasranger]

used both for years. I like the handling qualities of the colt, but the remingtons have a lot to be desired. best is to handle both and see what feels best in your hand. stick with a steel frame.

[flintboomer]

Uberti and Pietta each have their strengths and weaknesses and I have both brands. The triggers can be really stout on the Piettas and will need cleaned up. I have one Uberti and I prefer it. The front sight on the Uberti Remington is adjustable (dovetailed) which is a big plus if the point of impact is off to the left or right and the front sights will need adjustment on most of them.

Max load for a .44 will be 30-35 gr unless you get a brass frame, then max load is 25 gr and less is better.
Accuracy depends on the pistol, my brass frame pietta colt liked 21 gr 3f and my Uberti Remington likes 30-35 gr. I haven't found a load that works in my "target model" Pietta Remington, but it looks like 25-30 gr and a low hold are good possibilities. Some of them like a bore button under the ball, but my Uberti prefers lube over the ball instead.