ok heres my issue.. im currently shooting a PRB at 124 gr./ .435 ball with a .015 pillow ticking patch lubed with a mixture of deertallow and lard. loading the PRB is really difficult the patches are well greased, i swab between shots and i make a habit of spitting a little down the barrel before the PRB is loaded.. im loading from a loading block. what patching material would be good to bring the thickness down a bit?? i dont really want to lower my ball size any and lose grains for deerhunting and other game. any suggestions?? im looking at about a .010 thickness patch but need to know what material to use so i can get it by the yard locally and hopefully cheaper than buying specially made precut patches. BTW im shooting a 45 cal rifle.
Unbleached muslin at fabric shop . It runs .010-.012" .
OK that sounds good... i got an old worn out pair of cotton khakis would they work OK
Quote from: kybackwoodsman on November 12, 2010, 12:47:01 AM
ok heres my issue.. im currently shooting a PRB at 124 gr./ .435 ball with a .015 pillow ticking patch lubed with a mixture of deertallow and lard. loading the PRB is really difficult the patches are well greased, i swab between shots and i make a habit of spitting a little down the barrel before the PRB is loaded.. im loading from a loading block. what patching material would be good to bring the thickness down a bit?? i dont really want to lower my ball size any and lose grains for deerhunting and other game. any suggestions?? im looking at about a .010 thickness patch but need to know what material to use so i can get it by the yard locally and hopefully cheaper than buying specially made precut patches. BTW im shooting a 45 cal rifle.
You're loading 124 grains of powder behind a 45 caliber round ball? That's a ton of powder and beyond maximum for my .54 Trade rifle!
I am told that there is some variance in the thickness of pillow ticking depending on it's color, red, blue or green, and I'd take your mic over to the store that has all three to compare side by size, then factor in each type after washing the sizing out. You might also think about trying a dry lube on some of the patching you have right now and see if that gives you similar accuracy and easier loading.
But, if you'll PM me with your address I will send you a bunch of pre-cut patches, some are dry lubed already but they range from .010 to .020 in thickness so you can see if thinner patches are the solution before putting a lot of time or money into it. No charge.
William
I'm pretty sure he means 124gr is the ball weight. I have this exact problem with my .50 Lyman Trade Rifle. I will stick with my thick patches though. I do not want want to lose any accuracy. I can cloverleaf them at 50yds with my current set up. I made myself a short antler starter and hat helps a lot.
Joshua
PM sent, yes the 124 grain is the round ball i shoot about 80 grains of powder. ill try the thinner patches out, and go from there.. frankly i dont recall having this much resistance in loading with other rifles i have to pound on my ball starter with my palm HARD to get it to go in.. but i think dropping it down from .015 to around .010-.012 thickness may help.. we'll
Quote from: kybackwoodsman on November 12, 2010, 01:30:03 AM
PM sent, yes the 124 grain is the round ball i shoot about 80 grains of powder. ill try the thinner patches out, and go from there.. frankly i dont recall having this much resistance in loading with other rifles i have to pound on my ball starter with my palm HARD to get it to go in.. but i think dropping it down from .015 to around .010-.012 thickness may help.. we'll
Ah, now I understand, thought that was a roaring powder charge at 124. Those patches should arrive next week so keep us informed on what happens.
If that combination is very tight in what is supposed to be a .45, my first thought would be that you have an older import. Some of those were marked .45 but were actually .44s.
If you can find thinner linen you can try that. It's tough and holds up well. Using a thinner patch with an 80 grain load my start tearing and burning your patches. You will need to keep an eye out for that happening.
I have a "tight" .45 that really loads more easily with a thinner patch. I recommend an over powder wad to protect the patch. You might also consider a .433-.435 ball and a thicker patch.
do i lose any stopping power when i drop down to a smaller ballsize??
The ball weight between .430 and .435 is negligable. You are only talking of a few grains difference. I am using .430 balls with .018 prelubed pillow ticking and have no problem loading. I can't start the ball with just thumb pressure but starts with hitting the short starter with medium force with my palm. Then it is no problem running the patch and ball the rest of the way down the barrel.
OK, what do you mean "spit a little down the barrel before the prb is loaded"? You shouldn't need to spit down the barrel. For lubed patches there is no need. If dry patches you would use spit to wet the patch not the bore. ??? Sorry just not quite understanding.
When I can find it there is a thinner flowered pillow ticking that is about .010 and a very tight weave. I get mine from fabric stores and it is found with the striped mattress ticking that most people call pillow ticking. The difference between the two is that Mattress ticking is about .015-.017 and a softer weave. Either one works great if they are the thickness you need. The big advantage is that a yard of fabric costs less than 100 precut commercial patches and you get enough fabric for 500-1000 patches. The disadvantage is that the next bolt of fabric you find may not be exactly what you had been using and could change how your gun shoots or at least how it loads.
ok som ething im not sure about is dry lubed patches.. what does that mean?
Quote from: kybackwoodsman on November 13, 2010, 12:18:46 AM
ok som ething im not sure about is dry lubed patches.. what does that mean?
Dry lube is just that, it's been previously applied to the patch material then the water is allowed to evaporate leaving only the lube behind in a dry form. Some people swear by them, some don't think they work at all, just a matter of taste I suppose. Most of the dry lube recipes I have seen involve Ballistol, which I cannot stand the smell of.
well as far a lubing my patches ive worked up a lube of part deer tallow and part lard, heat on the woodstove in skillet til melted together, and lay each patch in the fat until soaked then removed and layed on a piece of wax paper til cool.so far ive had good luck with this lube with staying on the patches and not getting to soft or to hard.
How is the crown on barrel ? Is it smooth , have little ripples/grooves ? Rough or polished ? Take a piece of 240 grit wet/dry automotive sandpaper and wet a 2"x2" square of it with a little oil on it or water and place it on muzzle and use your thumb then push down hard on muzzle and twist/rotate back and forth and polish the crown real slick and that will help starting ball .
ok ill try that, the crown does look good on the rifle.. i was wondering if i could have the muzzle coned.. i understand that the original rifles were done that way and if pretty well eliminates the need of a ball starter.
Just thought of something.... I wonder how bacon grease would work for a patch lube? Always have plenty of it after making breakfast.
any good tight weave cotton material is a good candidate for patching mostly it's the thickness that makes a difference in loading and accuracy,although I do use mostly striped pillow ticking annd it was specified for patching by The U.S.Gov. I think back in the midle to late 1800's[I read the specification but i don't remember it's date .I check my wife's quilt scraps for cotton at .015 ,,then I smear it with Bore Butter and roll it up tightly stick it in the Micro-wave for 10-20 seconds then I cut the rolls into 1'' strips and then unroll and cut them as I shoot,a few rolls in my possibles bag lasts forever kept in a baggie to keep them clean.
Bacon grease has a lot of salt, and salt = rust so I'd be leary of bacon fat. IMHO
Crown polishing does work. I did it on one of mine, and while I still have to use a short starter - shallow grooves - , the patches come out pristine and don't snag being started. Yep, bacon grease has mucho salt. Avoid anything that MIGHT contain salt.
Just my 2 cents: I shot 2 dozen balls out of the .32 this morning. 20 grains of Goex 3F black Powder..310 round ball and a .10 thousandths patch...Ox Yoke wonder patches - prelubed - NO trouble in starting the load and no sticking between shots. No cleaning between shots either. I do not use a starter. The rifle shoots a lot better than I do. I am not sure if the Ox Yoke patches are OK for a Primitive Rendezvous. But I have used them exclusively for 10+ years with absolutely no trouble! Now if I get the Right eye fixed that is out of focus - I may be able to tag some tree rats. Today's score: Tim-3: Tree Rats-Mostly safe and having a Laughing fit at my Innaccuracy...
Very true about the salt. Didn't think of that.
One other thing i need to check that Wyoming Mike brought up, is that my rifle is an older import and it might be under bored to 44 cal. ill have to check that.